Category:Rogues - Revision history

Vagonuth: added anna

2025-04-10T20:45:09Z

added anna

3nki: /* Rogue Creation */

2023-07-10T15:42:56Z

Rogue Creation

Uberelf at 00:30, 12 January 2022

2022-01-12T00:30:14Z

3nki at 15:26, 7 October 2020

2020-10-07T15:26:02Z

3nki: /* Fighting */

2017-01-16T03:59:43Z

Fighting

3nki: /* Worshipping */ Shz is actually not so bad for rog

2014-06-27T01:59:46Z

Worshipping: Shz is actually not so bad for rog

3nki: /* Rogues in General */

2013-12-18T06:06:36Z

Rogues in General

3nki: /* Rogue Creation */

2013-11-22T02:22:22Z

Rogue Creation

3nki: /* Worshipping */ pretty sure it's like sharpen row on main worship table

2013-10-13T02:54:31Z

Worshipping: pretty sure it's like sharpen row on main worship table

3nki: /* Worshipping */

2013-05-30T20:22:08Z

Worshipping

@@ Line 45: / Line 45: @@
 === Worshipping ===
-'''Shizaga vs. Tor:''' Depending on race and gameplay style, most rogues worship one of these two gods, with Tor being more common due to more beneficial bonuses in terms of melee damage and [[Devotion|devotion]] bonuses at hero. However, since Tor reduces practice point gains as well as effective intelligence when practicing - it is sometimes better to leave off worship until Hero 101 and remain atheist at lowmort.
+'''Annakinesia vs Shizaga vs. Tor:''' Depending on race and gameplay style, most rogues worship one of these two gods, with Tor being more common due to more beneficial bonuses in terms of melee damage and [[Devotion|devotion]] bonuses at hero. However, since Tor reduces practice point gains as well as effective intelligence when practicing - it is sometimes better to leave off worship until Hero 101 and remain atheist at lowmort. Annakinesia can be attractive for the balance of extra xp, extra hp, rogue damage and - physical lag %.
 {| border="1" cellpadding="1" cellspacing="0" align="center"
@@ Line 51: / Line 51: @@
 |-
 ! align="center" style="background:#ffdead;" colspan=2 | EFFECTS PER DEITY
 ! align="center" style="background:#ffdead;width:48px" | [[Shizaga   |Shz]]
 ! align="center" style="background:#ffdead;width:48px" | [[Tor       |Tor]]
 |-
 ! align="left" style="background:#efefef;" rowspan=2 | Regeneration Rate
 ! align="left" style="background:#efefef;" | [[Hit Points |Hit Points]]
 | align="center" style="background:#ffbbbb;color:#ff0000" | -10%
 | align="center" style="background:#eeeeff;color:#0000ff" | +05%
 |-
 ! align="left" style="background:#efefef;" | [[Mana Points |Mana Points]]
-| align="center" style="background:#ffffff; | 0%
+|?
-| align="center" style="background:#ffffff; |  0%
+| align="center" style="background:#ffffff;color:#ffffff" | 00%
 |-
 ! align="left" style="background:#efefef;" rowspan=2 | [[Cast |Spellcasting]]
 ! align="left" style="background:#efefef;" | Cost
 | align="center" style="background:#eeeeff;color:#0000ff" | -05%
 | align="center" style="background:#ffdddd;color:#ff0000" | +10%
 |-
 ! align="left" style="background:#efefef;" | Lag
 | align="center" style="background:#ddddff;color:#0000ff" | -20%
-| align="center" style="background:#ffffff; | 0%
+| align="center" style="background:#ffffff;color:#ffffff" | 00%
 |-
-! align="left" style="background:#efefef;" colspan=2 | Physical Ability Lag
+! align="left" style="background:#efefef;" rowspan=3 | Combat Damage
 ! align="left" style="background:#efefef;" | Melee Weapon
 | align="center" style="background:#ffdddd;color:#ff0000" | worse
 | align="center" style="background:#bbbbff;color:#0000ff" | better
 |-
 ! align="left" style="background:#efefef;" | Rogue Damage
 | align="center" style="background:#ddddff;color:#0000ff" | better
 | align="center" style="background:#bbbbff;color:#0000ff" | best
 |-
 ! align="left" style="background:#efefef;" colspan=2 | Combat [[Experience Points |Experience-Point]] Gains
 | align="center" style="background:#eeeeff;color:#0000ff" | +05%
-| align="center" style="background:#ffffff; |  0%
+| align="center" style="background:#eeeeff;color:#0000ff" | +05%
 |-
 ! align="left" style="background:#efefef;" colspan=2 | Death [[Experience Points |Experience-Point]] Losses
-| align="center" style="background:#ffffff; |  0%
+|?
 | align="center" style="background:#ddddff;color:#0000ff" | -05%
 |-
 ! align="left" style="background:#efefef;" rowspan=3 | Levelup Gains
 ! align="left" style="background:#efefef;" | [[Hit Points |Hit Points]]
-| align="center" style="background:#ffffff; | same
+| align="center" style="background:#ddddff;color:#0000ff" | better
-| align="center" style="background:#ffffff; | same
+| align="center" style="background:#ffffff;color:#ffffff" | same
 |-
 ! align="left" style="background:#efefef;" | [[Mana Points |Mana Points]]
 | align="center" style="background:#bbbbff;color:#0000ff" | best
 | align="center" style="background:#ffdddd;color:#ff0000" | worse
 |-
 ! align="left" style="background:#efefef;" | [[Practice Points |Practice Points]]<sup>[2]</sup>
 | align="center" style="background:#bbbbff;color:#0000ff" |  +1
 | align="center" style="background:#ffeeee;color:#ff0000" | -1
 |-
 ! align="left" style="background:#efefef;" colspan=2 | Effective [[Intelligence|Int]] for [[Practice Points|Practicing]]
 | align="center" style="background:#ffeeee;color:#ff0000" | -0.5
 | align="center" style="background:#ffcccc;color:#ff0000" | -1.5

@@ Line 23: / Line 23: @@
 * [[Dexterity]] - those rogues that would rather tank benefit from the [[Armor Class|AC]] boost provided by high dexterity. It also improves their dodge skill.
-Kzinti, halflings, orcs (to name a few) have good dexterity, orcs and gargoyles have a damage modifier, and imps are also often considered due to their increasing damage modifier and dexterity that passes many races at lord tier.
+Kzinti, halflings, orcs (to name a few) have good dexterity, orcs and gargoyles have a damage modifier, and imps are also often considered due to their increasing damage modifier and dexterity that passes many races at lord tier. It's worth noting that negative stealth attributes such as very large size are not as much of a factor at lord due to +stealth gear and the leadership skill [[mastermind]].
 Rebirth consists of speaking with the weaver, the guildmaster, and bringing him a claw of tyran-o-bambi, bronze snake armbands, and buck-skin gloves.

← Older revision		Revision as of 00:30, 12 January 2022
Line 24:		Line 24:

	Kzinti, halflings, orcs (to name a few) have good dexterity, orcs and gargoyles have a damage modifier, and imps are also often considered due to their increasing damage modifier and dexterity that passes many races at lord tier.		Kzinti, halflings, orcs (to name a few) have good dexterity, orcs and gargoyles have a damage modifier, and imps are also often considered due to their increasing damage modifier and dexterity that passes many races at lord tier.
		+
		+	Rebirth consists of speaking with the weaver, the guildmaster, and bringing him a claw of tyran-o-bambi, bronze snake armbands, and buck-skin gloves.

	== Rogues at Lowmort Tier ==		== Rogues at Lowmort Tier ==

← Older revision		Revision as of 15:26, 7 October 2020
Line 1:		Line 1:
−	''The rogue is not concerned with the "virtues" of knighthood, nobility, or morality. The rogue serves no one but themselves. Rogues are masters of deception, [[Steal \|theft]], and the effective but honorless ability to stab others in the back. These fellows are not disciplined like soldiers, but they tend to be very quick, often eluding more powerful foes and are quick to relieve the general populace of their heavy coins and possessions. These untrustworthy souls utilize their knowledge of the city to evaluate and [[Steal \|steal]] items of great value, [[Fence \|fence]] them at great profit, [[Sneak Attack \|surprise]] their enemies or 'marks,' and evade their antagonists with great alacrity. The [[Prime Requisite \|prime requisite]] of rogues is [[Dexterity \|DEXterity]] which makes them very slippery opponents. [[Strength \|Strength]] is desirable to make their primary attack, the [[Backstab \|backstab]], more powerful and to allow them to carry more loot. [[Intelligence \|Intelligence]] is a big plus, allowing them to learn their [[:Category: Rogue Skills And Spells \|skills]] quickly and expertly as well as to assist their streetsmarts. And as with all [[:Category: Classes \|classes]], a hardy [[Constitution \|constitution]] will help them survive in the lethal dark alleyways and sidestreets of the big cities.''	+	''The rogue is not concerned with the "virtues" of knighthood, nobility, or morality. The rogue serves no one but themselves. Rogues are masters of deception, [[Steal \|theft]], and the effective but honorless ability to stab others in the back.''
		+
		+	''These fellows are not disciplined like soldiers, but they tend to be very quick, often eluding more powerful foes and are quick to relieve the general populace of their heavy coins and possessions. These untrustworthy souls utilize their knowledge of the city to evaluate and [[Steal \|steal]] items of great value, [[Fence \|fence]] them at great profit, [[Sneak Attack \|surprise]] their enemies or 'marks,' and evade their antagonists with great alacrity.''
		+
		+	''The [[Prime Requisite \|prime requisite]] of rogues is [[Dexterity \|DEXterity]] which makes them very slippery opponents. [[Strength \|Strength]] is desirable to make their primary attack, the [[Backstab \|backstab]], more powerful and to allow them to carry more loot. [[Intelligence \|Intelligence]] is a big plus, allowing them to learn their [[:Category: Rogue Skills And Spells \|skills]] quickly and expertly as well as to assist their streetsmarts. And as with all [[:Category: Classes \|classes]], a hardy [[Constitution \|constitution]] will help them survive in the lethal dark alleyways and sidestreets of the big cities.''

	'''Abbreviation:''' Rog.		'''Abbreviation:''' Rog.

@@ Line 185: / Line 185: @@
 After Hero 101, the rogue can open with a [[Backstab]] and thus deal considerable damage. With the increasing levels (and HP) one can shed tank gear and replace it for DR gear to do even more damage this way. See [[Tanking In Hit Gear]] for some gear replacement suggestions.
-'''Hitting:''' Rogues do not hit well until they get third attack and enhanced damage. Afterwards they approach solid damage if not worshiping Shizaga. In large groups the rogues should be stabbing in full DR gear (and immediately rescued by the group's actual tanks.
+'''Hitting:''' Rogues do not hit well until they get third attack and enhanced damage. Afterwards they approach solid damage if not worshiping Shizaga. In large groups the rogues should be stabbing in full DR gear (and immediately rescued by the group's actual tanks).
 '''Healing:''' Rogues can brandish healing staves and do have access to [[Heal]] spell in true emergencies. However, their strengths lie elsewhere.

@@ Line 111: / Line 111: @@
 Rogues are not spell casters and have little use of mana. Their mana gains are thus similar to warriors - and the extent of their spellcasting throughout the tiers is only to cast immediate combat buffs such as [[Sanctuary]] or [[Frenzy]].
-Since Shizaga reduces regular melee damage, Tor is overall a better choice, unless one is in hurry to remort and goes for the XP bonus. Do keep in mind that Shizaga devotion later at hero tier also grants additional dexterity, so Shizaga may be a bit more useful to those wishing to tank their way through hero tier and do not rely on melee damage. Also, remember that worship affects crafting skills such as [[Poison Weapon | poison weapon]] (shz is better than tor).
+Shizaga reduces regular melee damage, but increases the success of Rogue skills like backstab. Also, remember that worship affects crafting skills such as [[Poison Weapon | poison weapon]] (shz is better than tor). Most people still say Tor is overall a better choice, unless one is in hurry to remort and goes for the XP bonus. Do keep in mind that Shizaga devotion later at hero tier also grants additional dexterity, so Shizaga may be a bit more useful to those wishing to tank their way through hero tier.
 === Fighting ===

@@ Line 7: / Line 7: @@
 == Rogues in General ==
-Rogues are a versatile class that can both hit and tank well, has many interesting abilities, and can access powerful prestige classes.
+Rogues are a versatile class that can both hit and tank well, have many interesting abilities, and can access powerful prestige classes.
 At hero tier rogues learn to specialize in powerful backstabbing attacks, a practice that only increases in power at lord tier, and their inherent high dexterity makes them formidable tanks.

@@ Line 13: / Line 13: @@
 == Rogue Creation ==
-When choosing the race for a new rogue, following factors are important, but none of them are critical:
+When choosing a race for a new rogue the following factors are important, but none of them are critical:
 * [[Racial Damage Modifier]] - this is a racial ability to do significantly more damage both in melee and when using backstabbing attacks. It is important for rogues that focus on stabbing.
 * [[Racial Stealth Modifier]] - frequent backstabbing requires good stealth, and some races are better at this than others.
-* [[Dexterity]] - those rogues that would rather tank benefit from the [[Armor Class|AC]] boost by high dexterity.
+* [[Dexterity]] - those rogues that would rather tank benefit from the [[Armor Class|AC]] boost provided by high dexterity. It also improves their dodge skill.
-Kzinti, halflings, orcs (to name a few) have good dexterity, orcs, gargoyles have a damage modifier, and imps are also often considered due to their increasing damage modifier and dexterity that peak many races at lord tier.
+Kzinti, halflings, orcs (to name a few) have good dexterity, orcs and gargoyles have a damage modifier, and imps are also often considered due to their increasing damage modifier and dexterity that passes many races at lord tier.
 == Rogues at Lowmort Tier ==